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Interview With Dr. Bruce Maccabee December 2, 2008
Part III of III
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Ken: Do you think that cattle mutilation has anything to do with UFOs? Do you think that there is something sinister going on there like maybe the government is checking to see the radiation level in cattle since most of these things occur in the midwest where there has been nuclear testing? Dr. Maccabee: Well that sort of is the nuclear testing and cattle being sensitive to radiation and so on theory, because they are eating grass that could be contaminated and all that. That might be possible for some things, but we have so many cases where animals are found dead with no tracks anywhere, with no blood. Why in the world would they be trying to drain an animal of blood if they are trying to track nuclear stuff? . All they have to do is kill them, kill the animal, chop off a piece of it and examine a chunk of flesh or something. Taking the time to core out rectums and pick out various sexual organs, whether they are male or female or so on and then if these animals are not killed in a normal manner and left in the field, all sorts of vermin and other animals will come and chew them up quickly. I remember on tv an experiment was done to see how long it would take for a deer carcass, I think it was, to disappear. They killed the deer and left the camera watching it and it was three or four days or something like that before it was reduced to bones because everything from ants to animals attacked it. . Ken: Yeah I saw that. Dr. Maccabee: The point is that I doubt that the bulk of what are classified as cattle mutilations have anything to do with tracking of radiation by the U.S. government or satanic cults making percussion cuts and stuff like that and being able to do this from air borne craft too and wiping out cattle without any trace other than the cow itself. Then of course there are a few cases where you actually have witnesses seeing something being pulled up or dropped down whatever. I suspect that these cattle mutilations are related to alien stuff. I make the same speculation with respect to crop circles. the real agraglif, pictures drawn in agricultural growth, corn, beans, wheat, whatever. Most of that happens in England, I don't know why, but certainly it is a world wide phenomena. A. J. Gevaerd in Brazil reported on what he said was the first agraglif in Brazil, a couple of concentric circles in wheat, some type of wheat that were laid down in typical agraglif manner with a sharp edge to where the grass grows tall and straight, versus where it is lying down, unbroken branches and stalks, the things that have come to characterize what Ik call the true agraglifs, as opposed to the things where somebody goes around stomping with a board, the Doug and Dave Chorley method. Ken: Dr. Maccabee: First of all I don't think that they are the most secretive in history and that is a lot of hype for political purposes, but who cares now anyway? Clinton in the late 90s signed executive order 12953 or something, whatever the number was, it was supposed to release stuff that was more than 25 years old that was at a secret level and 35 years if it was top secret, I don't remember the exact parameters, but supposedly it was going to reduce the amount of classified information. They had the rule if you are in doubt whether it was classified or not, previously when in doubt you would classify it, now they were going to say that if you were in doubt, declassify it. That didn't last too long as I recall. Then when Bush took over he sort of went back to the when in doubt classify it type of thing. So that may be why the opponents were saying that it was the most secretive ever. Anyway, the top secret stuff has never been released, there must be some, except for..... maybe I could name a couple of documents, maybe a handful over the last sixty years that have been released. Whether they will ever be released or not, I don't know. There are stories that the president himself is in a position to learn about UFOs. Things might get better under this Obama administration, but i am sure that Obama has plenty of stuff to worry about besides UFOs. Ken: I am sure he does. Dr. Maccabee: Ken: Right.
Ken Arnold Showing What He Saw In 1947 Dr. Maccabee: I wouldn't be surprised if the British Government had checked back with somebody in the U.S. government to say should we release this because it involves your people? So it is where they were releasing stuff that involves Americans or maybe they checked with Canada or Germany or France when they were releasing stuff that related to other countries. The stuff that was related to Britain, I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't say anything. Remember all the stuff that they are releasing is just stories, there is nobody releasing hard evidence. The U.S. Government hasn't released a piece of the Roswell crash. I don't know if Britain has anything comparable or not, or Germany, France or Brazil, whatever. Nobody has released anything that I am aware of anyway, which can definitely be tied with a flying saucer or E.T. craft and at the same time can be shown to be completely anomalous. A long time ago, this lady I was told about, supposedly examined a creature from.., non human creature, not from the earth. Being an anatomist she knew that it wasn't anything normal. She had all this information about it and after she did the examination she was told to forget about the whole thing. She said well I know about this stuff and they told her I know, but when you leave, you leave without any hard evidence at all, its just a story and stories now can be explained. Ken: Yeah, right. In other words they will make her look like a fool. Dr. Maccabee: Yeah. Dr. Maccabee: Well when you mean reports like that included? Ken: In the release. Dr. Maccabee: The report goes back many years and the actual guy was interviewed I believe. In other words the story has been reported in UFO, Flying Saucer Review, something like that, years ago. If it is the aliens and they only have to look at people who are young enough to procreate or whatever, maybe that guy was just too old to do anything related to sex let's say. Since there are so many cases of abductions involving....where they do some sort of sexual related testing, that seems to be some key aspect of whatever they are doing and if they find somebody that is too old to do anything, it might well be that they reject the person. I think maybe Dave Jacobs or Budd Hopkins, I think Jacobs has said if you are not abducted by the time you are ten, you are not going to be. The point being that you can be abducted numerous times over your life, but they start while you are fertile. Ken: Yeah I never heard that one but it makes sense doesn't it? Dr. Maccabee: I certainly can't confirm or deny it. Ken: I know that. Comment: (Small laugh over this)
UFO Over Argentina Dr. Maccabee: If aliens are around. I remember Whitley talking about being in a book store after his book Communion came out and being freaked out by people or what seemed to be people, or on the other hand he got the definite impression that they might be aliens checking up on his book or something like that. I am not aware of either Dave Jacobs or Budd Hopkins saying anything that they actually met an alien. But of course aliens in abduction stories, you meet the alien in the abduction story. Ken: Right. Dr. Maccabee: I have to say that I wouldn't be surprised if somebody had met an alien. Ken: Well this person told me that he had met somebody that looked entirely human, but the reason he felt that they were alien was because they contacted him using telepathy. Dr. Maccabee: Yeah well that would certainly clue one in that there certainly is something strange going on. Ken: Do you think that the world is on the verge on some UFO mega-event as some people have postulated? Dr. Maccabee: Well I suppose it could be, it might not be something that happens in a 24 hour period, or even over a few weeks, but I think this situation of more and more information on the Internet, tv shows that seem to be taking this more seriously. It could be the mega event unfolding before our very eyes ultimately resulting in a general admission that yeah, they are here now what do we do about it, or do we do anything? That general admission is coming as a trickle up admission. I have often felt that as soon as over 50% of the people are witnesses, or maybe 70% or 80%, you name the percentage, somebody will stand up and say, hey look they are real. This is what I call the King has no clothes effect. Somebody will stand up and say hey they are real and everybody else will stand up and say hey that's right, we knew that all along. Ken: Some naval ships seem to have had more than their share of UFO events. Many crew members have come forward with stories of UFO sightings and UFO events. One was said to have occurred in 1971 that affected the carrier John F. Kennedy. It was said to be a UFO hovering over the ship that was causing many of the instruments to go haywire. Have you ever heard of reports like this? Dr. Maccabee: I don't recall that specific one, although it could be one that was reported years ago in some how or another and I don't recall. there certainly have been sightings at sea by the navy, one that is on my website goes all the way back to 1904, I think it was. The sighting of three glowing objects traveling along underneath the clouds and then suddenly shooting stuff up into the sky. That is what I call remarkable meteors at my website. I am presuming you will put my website on your website or something? Ken: Oh sure, sure. I will put a link in the story, I always do that. Dr. Maccabee: The remarkable meteor story was a navy report that got published in a magazine called the Monthly Weather Review, with a title Remarkable Meteors and that is how I knew what to call them. These meteors managed to change direction. that doesn't sound like meteoric to me. Anyway in 1952 there were Operation Mainbrace sightings. Mainbrace was an American and British and maybe some other countries involved in maneuvers in the northern Atlantic Ocean. In several sightings they had disc shaped craft flying over the ships that were reported at least in UFO publications. I don't know if they got reported at all in the general media. Apparently there were some people that had some pretty good sightings then. The Brazilian navy of course had its sighting of the Trindade case which resulted in photos that were published in Brazil that were actually endorsed as being real photos by the Brazilian government. Ken: Wasn't that the one where the president was on one of the ships, the Brazilian government? Dr. Maccabee: No. There was one ship, I forget the name of the ship, I can't pronounce it anyway. There was one ship with a professional photographer on board to take pictures of the naval activities during the International Geophysical Year, IGY, which was 1958. For several days they had magnetic events and sightings. Finally during one of these events they called a professional photographer in and he took 4 or 5 photographs, four of which show this object, which looks like the planet Saturn actually, if you know what Saturn looks like with the rings. Ken: Yes I do. Dr. Maccabee: This thing looked roughly like that. Anyway the Trindade Island case which is to be looked up on the Internet. That involved the Brazilian navy. I know that there have been some reports from the time of the Vietnam war, the late 60s. I don't know how many cases of other navy reports there are? There may be a lot of stuff that just happened to the navy that just doesn't get out. Ken: I'm sure. Dr. Maccabee: Yeah, well I don't know how many crashes. I know that there have been a lot of reports of crashes. That doesn't mean that we believe that all of those reports are true. Ken: That's for sure.
UFO Over The North China Sea And Korea Dr. Maccabee: The Aztec case was supposedly a major one, second after Roswell and although there has been some evidence dug up that something might have happened, I don't think that anyone has pinned the tail on the donkey there. Ryan Wood came out with a book a couple of years ago about all the crashes that he was able to dig up. The one that I worked on included a case reported by Air Force Colonel Robert Willingham which happened sometime in the 50s, 58 I think it was, just across the Rio Grande River, in Mexico, not far from Del Rio I guess it was, I don't know exactly. There is a book out on this particular case, I think that it is called the other Roswell. Anyway that sounds like a pretty good case, unfortunately it only involves one witness. It did involve a witness collecting some material and supposedly having it tested and having that material stolen by the government. Anyway there are a couple of such crashes that one can talk about. Supposedly one in the plains of San Augustin at the same time as the Roswell case. If the plains of San Augustin story is correct then the government got a whole thing with aliens together with whatever landed at Roswell. Anyway there are maybe a handful of cases. Does that mean that its ridiculous to talk about crashes because they are so great? Well the aliens can make mistakes too I suppose. Ken: I guess so. Dr. Maccabee: Who knows what stresses their aircraft might experience in our atmosphere and so on? Maybe they are pushing their technology to be able to do what they do? Whenever you push technology beyond its rated capability, you have to expect certain things to go wrong. I don't think that there have been hundreds of crashes, but there might have been a dozen or so or a handful over the years. Ken: I am just going to ask you a couple of more questions on graphics programs, then I'll let you go, I know that you must be getting tired. Dr. Maccabee: Of course that is a reverse question. The usual question is the hoax look like a real one. Ken: Yeah I know, it is just the opposite. Comment: (We both laughed at this question). Dr. Maccabee: Can you make a real one look like a hoax? Ken: No not exactly. Dr. Maccabee: If he does it by accident? Ken: By accident, right. Dr. Maccabee: I suppose it certainly could if it were super crisp and the object moved in some way or some dynamical aspects of the object suggest that it could only have been done by cgi or computer generated image or something. You could be unlucky I guess. The skeptics would say that all the photos of ufos, all the photos, none of them are real, they ALL look like hoaxes. Ken: Yeah right.
First UFO Photo 1871 Dr. Maccabee: Of course the ones that I have spent the most time, on the McMinnville photos of 1950s and they were taken by Paul Trent and his wife. There have been some good documentaries on that recently. By the way, I don't know if you are interested in this case or not.... Ken: I am interested in all cases. Dr. Maccabee: Life Magazine recently posted on the Internet a whole bunch of pictures taken at the time, just after those photos. Pictures of the Trent's and of their farm and so on. Those pictures having been posted after 60 years have answered a few questions that were raised in my attempt to reconstruct the Trent farm. So they have provided information that has essentially been withheld since 1950. Anyway the pictures are nice because the pictures are so crisp that it is either the real thing or a hoax. The skeptic's movement say that there is no such thing as the real thing so it looks to me like a hoax. Ken: Yeah of course. Dr. Maccabee: The only problem is to prove that it was a hoax. There is nothing in the pictures that absolutely prove that its a hoax, so you end up having to rely on the contextual evidence, the story behind it. So if somebody brings me a film, or photos that are actually real, but looks like a hoax, I suppose for example that you could be unlucky and take a picture of an object, let's say in the Trent case they have taken a picture of an object and it definitely appears beneath overhead wires, so the hoax hypothesis would be that you hang this object, a model, from a very thin string and you hang it from the wire. There is no such image of a string available in the Trent photos. Suppose that they had been unlucky and there had been a tall thin branch of a bush or something going upwards that went through the image of the UFO and upwards to the wires? Ken: Exactly. Dr. Maccabee: Then you could say well, it was a real UFO, but somehow this branch makes it look like it was hanging from the wires. That could be a strange situation, but one can imagine something unlucky like that or maybe a scratch on the negative that looked like a string or something? Ken: Are there any particular effects that people use to disguise these fraudulent pictures, that you look for? Dr. Maccabee: Well it depends on the type of picture of course and it depends if it is old fast photography using film or new fast photography using digital cameras. If you use digital cameras you really have to track each pixel and see if the pixels change uniformly in the scene or there is some sudden jump in brightness, or some sudden jump in color, or something like that gives you the hint that there isn't a continuum here. Instead something has been inserted with an abrupt change of a background. Usually I guess you catch the hoaxers by looking at the background rather than the UFO image itself, unless there is something so obvious about the UFO image that would be a hoax. I don't know what that would be necessarily? If you have something like an extremely sharp image of a UFO embedded in a picture where all the other background images are fuzzy, you might say that this looks like a situation where the UFO was so close to the camera that you focused on the UFO or inserted the UFO and it was well focused, the background was out of focus became the UFO was up close. It would be a small thing close to the camera instead of being a big thing a long distance away. Ken: Or those artifacts you get when you cut out something and paste it. Dr. Maccabee: Yeah. The alternative would be that the background is in good focus and the UFO image itself is fuzzy. If that situation occurs, you look at the situation of how the fuzziness occurs. If it is an out of focus type of fuzziness, it should be fuzzy the same amount on all edges. If it is fuzzy because something is moving, then you can look to see if the fuzziness is greatest along the leading and gliding edges of the motion. Ken: Last Question. The government has not asked me to analyze a UFO photograph, movie or anything. Ken: I want to thank you very much Dr. maccabee that was..... Dr. Maccabee: They don't dare because I would tell everybody else. Comment: (We both had a good laugh about this) Ken: That was a very interesting interview. |
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